Crawler Track set up woes

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Enigma229
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Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Sat Dec 06, 2008 5:54 pm

I'm trying to understand how to rig a tracked vehicle up but I'm having a hard time getting it. I've gone through the manuals and even tried to follow the video tutorial done in Maya (I'm using Max) but still no luck. Could somebody post a screenshot or hierarchical layout (preferably for max) of how the rig is set up?

It seems the video in Maya takes a different approach than the manuals. In the manuals it says to set up a Crawler Extended first and then set up the Crawler Track.

Any help would probably get me over this hump.

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:24 pm


Enigma229
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:21 pm

Hi Carl,

Thanks for the reply. When I click on the link all I get is a blank page. :(

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:07 am

Sorry, FTP error. It should be fixed now.

Enigma229
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:36 pm

Carl! Thanks for taking the time to provide that!

So you don't have to use the Cog Wheels and bogies?

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:38 pm

Enigma229 wrote:Carl! Thanks for taking the time to provide that!

So you don't have to use the Cog Wheels and bogies?
CogWheels are needed in some of the tank's wheels are above the ground, such as the ABRAMS tank. Then you use Craft CogWheels to transfer the rotation from a wheel that touches the ground, to the wheel in the air.

Enigma229
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Tue Dec 09, 2008 2:45 pm

The cog wheels part was nebulous to me in the manual and Maya video. I understood that you would add the Active cog to the front lower wheel and the Passive cog to the front upper wheel. Here is an extract from the Crawler Tracks manual that confused me:
13. Parent the CogWheels_PassiveCog (the green disc) to the upper front high-poly wheel
14. Parent the upper high-poly wheel to the CogWheels_PassiveCog (the green disc).
This sounds like I am linking the Passive Cog to the high-poly wheel and then linking the high-poly wheel back to the Passive Cog.

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:08 pm

Enigma229 wrote:The cog wheels part was nebulous to me in the manual and Maya video. I understood that you would add the Active cog to the front lower wheel and the Passive cog to the front upper wheel. Here is an extract from the Crawler Tracks manual that confused me:
13. Parent the CogWheels_PassiveCog (the green disc) to CrawlerExt_ChassisRelocator
14. Parent the upper high-poly wheel to the CogWheels_PassiveCog (the green disc).
This sounds like I am linking the Passive Cog to the high-poly wheel and then linking the high-poly wheel back to the Passive Cog.
You're absolutely right. It should be this:

13. Parent the CogWheels_PassiveCog (the green disc) to CrawlerExt_ChassisRelocator.
14. Parent the upper high-poly wheel to the CogWheels_PassiveCog (the green disc).

I've updated the online help documentation. Sorry about the confusion!

Enigma229
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Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:20 pm

Sorry to bring this up again but I am still confused. I've downloaded the trial for the PRM Abrams as well as the Maya Abrams video and they are set up different.

Enigma229
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Wed Feb 04, 2009 12:55 am

Or even a 3ds Max video like the one linked above but also using the cogs to set up a tank front and rear upper wheels. :)

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:30 am

Does this clear up any confusion?
Image


Otherwise, please explain which part that you have problems with and I'll try to explain it more in detail.

Enigma229
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Wed Feb 04, 2009 5:59 pm

Hey Carl,

I noticed on the Abrams PRM rig and the Maya tank rig video that you have two sets of cog wheels. Do you need two or is one (like you show in the animated gif above and in Crawler tracks manual) sufficient?

Enigma229
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:02 pm

Okay, I am attaching a setup with just the rig. It's a 3ds max 2009 file. Maybe you guys can tell me what I have done wrong and even send back a corrected one if possible.

tank_03.max

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:39 am

Enigma229 wrote:Okay, I am attaching a setup with just the rig. It's a 3ds max 2009 file. Maybe you guys can tell me what I have done wrong and even send back a corrected one if possible.

tank_03.max
Thank you for providing us with a scene file Enigma229. The rigging looks very good, the problem with your scene is that you've probably Mirrored your Craft Crawler, which has messed up its transform. It's very strict with its transform so if you want to rotate it in any way you have to use rotate, not mirror.
To fix your scene without having to redo everything, unparent everything that's parented (linked) to Craft Crawler and delete the crawler and create a new one. Then parent the stuff that you unparented back to it.
Or you could try mirroring it back again, I'm not sure which will be easiest for you.

Regarding the need of 2x cogwheels, it depends on how your Craft CrawlerTracks was created. If you created your boogie wheels as "Static Wheel" then you need the 2nd cogwheel to give the front upper wheel its rotation. But if your wheels were created as non-Static Wheels then they will rotate with the driveWheel and there's no need for an extra cogwheel (you always need the first one though).

Let us know if you still have trouble with rigging the tank. It takes some work but once you're done you'll start reaping the reward, hehe.

Enigma229
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Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Wed Feb 18, 2009 2:09 am

I've been out of town and just got your response.
The rigging looks very good, the problem with your scene is that you've probably Mirrored your Craft Crawler, which has messed up its transform. It's very strict with its transform so if you want to rotate it in any way you have to use rotate, not mirror.
I think I did mirror the CrawlerExt. :oops:
Regarding the need of 2x cogwheels, it depends on how your Craft CrawlerTracks was created. If you created your boogie wheels as "Static Wheel" then you need the 2nd cogwheel to give the front upper wheel its rotation. But if your wheels were created as non-Static Wheels then they will rotate with the driveWheel and there's no need for an extra cogwheel (you always need the first one though).
So for a one cogwheel configuration: Use the bogie wheels (greenish colored ones) and not the support bogie wheels (redish colored ones)?

Example of a configuration with 5 wheels between the drive and idler wheels (going front to back)

idler, bogie(green), bogie(green), bogie(green), bogie(green), bogie(green), drive

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:21 pm

If by "Idler" you mean a Wheel that was created with "Static Wheel" checkbox UNchecked (I know it's checked in the image below, my bad), then that looks correct.
Image

Let us know if you have any other questions otherwise we look forward to the results!

Enigma229
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Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Thu Feb 19, 2009 6:23 pm

Carl, the Abrams PRM setup uses the name "idler" as one of the top wheels, the other one is the "driver" and this is what I am referring to.

Enigma229
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Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Mon Feb 23, 2009 7:22 pm

I think I got the hang of it now. :)

BTW- How would you recommend rigging a vehicle such as this one: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... z2luft.jpg

It's basically a hybrid motorcycle/tracked vehicle.

Enigma229
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Joined: Sun Nov 30, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Enigma229 » Tue Feb 24, 2009 4:40 am

Also, a little input I noticed from the Crawler Tracks manual....

On step 25, it mentions Make sure that "Inner Wheel" and "Static Wheel" is checked. Shouldn't static be unchecked?

I mention this because in above thread, http://forum.craftanimations.com/viewto ... 1225#p1225, you mentioned the need for only one set of cog wheels with non-static wheels and in the manual only one set is being used and the dialogue box graphic shows the "Static Wheel" box unchecked.

Carl Buhre
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Re: Crawler Track set up woes

Post by Carl Buhre » Tue Feb 24, 2009 8:51 am

Enigma229 wrote:I think I got the hang of it now. :)

BTW- How would you recommend rigging a vehicle such as this one: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... z2luft.jpg

It's basically a hybrid motorcycle/tracked vehicle.
Hmm, that's a tricky one. I guess you could come close by using Craft 2-Wheeler Extended as a base and then add a bunch of Craft ExtraWheels and Craft CrawlerTracks for the tracks. You will have to limit the sideways tilting for Craft 2-Wheeler Extended.

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